The Spoony Hou wrote:So, the credits run at 640x480 and the rest of the game runs at 320x240 all the time?
Yes. I honestly feel like I should suffix that with "I'm not kidding."
You can actually see in VRAM from the video I posted in the romhacking.net thread that everything else is 320x240 - the Policenauts title screen graphics and the "Epilogue" title card are all small 320 graphics and WHAM this big fucker of a 640 credits graphic comes in.
Even worse, it's not doing standard graphical stuff, it's doing this magic "move the framebuffer vertically downward and wrap" thing. It's honestly not surprising the GPU plugins have trouble with it. I guess. Believe it or not I didn't have to touch the GPU for the ROM hack until now. Everything was changing how the game drew (meaning writing the actual bytes into memory)
More playtesting has shown the the E}I{ Plugin actually works pretty damn good and I think is going to become "slowbeef's recommended ePSXe Plugin for Policenauts" (tm).
also, i don't think it's a good idea to make a rom patch tailored to incomplete/buggy emulators/plugins. once the game translation is out there would be incentive to implement the correct "code" to run konami's obscure credit-scrolling hacks. most likely since no other games use it and the game is not in english, no one bothered before or even knew about it.
maybe people can play the game using whatever emulator/plugin they want, do a save state at the end, and switch to the working emulator/plugin for the credits.
Kojima games owned: Snatcher (kinda) Metal Gear (kinda) Metal Gear Solid Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops
Piratero wrote:Will you guys release all the information based the FS used in Policenauts? Maybe I can help get the translation for the Sega Saturn considering that I have a good background on the hardware.
Being the case that you are interested, could you please wait until we release this and then I we'll figure out how we can work this out. In several cases I've checked how difficult it would be to apply the same changes to the Saturn version and I've found very small differences, so I believe the only big hurdle will be the asm changes.
also, i don't think it's a good idea to make a rom patch tailored to incomplete/buggy emulators/plugins. once the game translation is out there would be incentive to implement the correct "code" to run konami's obscure credit-scrolling hacks. most likely since no other games use it and the game is not in english, no one bothered before or even knew about it.
maybe people can play the game using whatever emulator/plugin they want, do a save state at the end, and switch to the working emulator/plugin for the credits.
QFT. This suggestion seems to be the only sane suggestion. Those who cannot shell out $20 for a PlayStation off eBay shouldn't be pampered with an emulator hack on a patch!
Again, I'm reiterating through again and again, but it needed to be said once more.
Artemio wrote:BTW... Do I know you from somewhere else?
OK. SegaXtreme maybe?
Bingo! Yes I used to hang around there quite a bit almost a decade ago... I even did some coding in C for the Saturn. CyberWarriorX helped a lot with getting this project started as a matter of fact.
From the mathematical perspective, consciousness might be regarded as a second derivative of sensation.
-- Terrel Miedaner
Artemio wrote:BTW... Do I know you from somewhere else?
OK. SegaXtreme maybe?
Bingo! Yes I used to hang around there quite a bit almost a decade ago... I even did some coding in C for the Saturn. CyberWarriorX helped a lot with getting this project started as a matter of fact.
I think you did write some 3D demos using the SGL. Yeah, CyberWarriorX has made a lot of contributions in not just translations, but just in everything in general.
Piratero wrote:I think you did write some 3D demos using the SGL. Yeah, CyberWarriorX has made a lot of contributions in not just translations, but just in everything in general.
Indeed, I had access to the softimage plug in to export models and did some very small experiments in the field.
Do you know what has happened with CyberWarriorX? Is he still active? I recall he retired from the "scene" some time ago.
From the mathematical perspective, consciousness might be regarded as a second derivative of sensation.
-- Terrel Miedaner
Piratero wrote:I think you did write some 3D demos using the SGL. Yeah, CyberWarriorX has made a lot of contributions in not just translations, but just in everything in general.
Indeed, I had access to the softimage plug in to export models and did some very small experiments in the field.
Do you know what has happened with CyberWarriorX? Is he still active? I recall he retired from the "scene" some time ago.
He is currently active working on Yabause. He has made a lot of progress with Guillaume.
A lot of people are going to be using emulators, because a lot of people don't want to mess around with mod-chips and importing.
You don't have to import to get a used PSX with mod-chip.
Just walk to the nearest store that sells used video game systems. Almost all used Playstation consoles I find in stores here are modded. (Because those are the only ones that are still likely to sell.)
Favorite Game: Shenmue I, MGS, Snatcher, Zelda: Ocarina Of Time.
Kojima games owned: Metal Gear (NES) Metal Gear: Ghost Babel (GB) Metal Gear Solid (PSX) Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance (PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence (PS2) Policenauts (Saturn/PSX/3DO) Snatcher (PC Engine/Mega CD) Zone Of The Enders (PS2) Zone Of The Enders 2: Special Edition (PS2) Super Smash Bros. Brawl; it counts, right? ;P
The reason for the focus on emulators, and ePSXe in particular, is mouse support. Policenauts was made to be played with one. Yes, there's a Playstation add-on, but that's another complication and cost (usually more than the PS itself) on top of the modded system. Also, how many console setups are ideally suited for point-and-clicking? I don't even have a TV myself.
I've already spent a couple hundred buying original copies of the game. Think I'll stop there.
However, I agree that if a bug isn't caused by the patch, it's not really our responsibility to fix it. Especially now that there are a couple of different workarounds.
Kojima games owned: Metal Gear Solid Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons Of liberty Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots Metal Gear Acid Snatcher(Sega CD) Policenauts(PSX) Metal Gear(Subsistence Version) Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake(Subsistence Version)
Kojima games owned: -Policenauts -Snatcher (Sega CD) -Metal Gear Solid I -Metal Gear Solid II - Substance -Metal Gear Solid III - Subsistence -Metal Gear: Ghost Babel -Zone of Enders 2: The Second Runner
Snatcher42 wrote:
However, I agree that if a bug isn't caused by the patch, it's not really our responsibility to fix it. Especially now that there are a couple of different workarounds.
True. But whatever you guys decide to do is fine. No rush.
Kojima games owned: Metal Gear Solid Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons Of liberty Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots Metal Gear Acid Snatcher(Sega CD) Policenauts(PSX) Metal Gear(Subsistence Version) Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake(Subsistence Version)
Kojima games owned: Metal Gear Snatcher - PS/JP Policenauts - PS/JP Metal Gear Solid - PS Metal Gear Solid 2: Subsitence - XB/PC Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsitience - PS2
I didn't realize Sony used the same numbering system for all their systems. Not that it's a logical misstep for anyone but me.
PSP-2000 = JP
PSP-2001 = US
PSP-2002 = dunno, but probably EU.
...
well those names are from using a tosec dat file + clrmame. so that's how they (tosec) named them. i know if you open the files in a hex editor and go to the bottom you can see a date + version number in them, but i haven't check them all myself.
I totally agree with el Piratero. That's pretty much what I wanted to say, just I didn't want to sound rude: "some" people can get very annoying and tend to forget these guys (Artemio, Marc, slowbeef, etc..) aren't paid to do this so we all should thankful and patient no matter when this patch is out
but generally speaking, yeah, I don't really get what's with these fucking emulators. You basically ruin the whole experience. Not only are they crippled, but old games look like shit on modern monitors anyway. These games are meant to be played on a low resolution CRT monitor/TV.
I also don't see where's the problem with costs. OK an original copy of Policenauts can fetch high prices, but ermm...you can get the romz on many places.
A PSX is $25-30, a mouse price varies between 5 and 20 bucks, IF they get even sold http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 3D1&_rdc=1
if you don't want to mod the console or are so unlucky to not finding an already modded one just get one of those action replay
I think that you're all forgetting that the patch needs to be tested on an emulator, instead of wasting hundreds of CD-R's in order to test it each time.
Stop complaining, stop mentioning prices...let people play the game how they choose, and let the team do what they please in regards to emulation vs. console playing.
Life and Death hang in perfect balance...I'm only here to tip the scales.
seraphssavior wrote:
let people play the game how they choose, and let the team do what they please in regards to emulation vs. console playing.
heh
well that is right but who was complaining? It's just that I really hate emulators and the way old videogames look on a PC and I noticed some of you were making a big deal about the costs involved in the whole thing
that's it
This is how I feel about the whole thing, in regards to the hack.
If you want to play Policenauts as originally intended, it will run fine on hardware. First and foremost, that's the job of a ROM hack. That said, I know that for some people that's a little less feasible or realistic - so to that end, I would like it if people can play it on an emulator. Reports suggest that if you use ePSXe 1.7 with the E}I{ Video Plugin, you can get through the whole game as originally intended. I have confirmed the ending plays correctly with the plugin, though I've yet to test the whole game on it (though what I have seen looks good). If you really don't want that plugin for whatever reason, the PEOpS GPU plugin almost does the job. If you choose that plugin, you'll have to forgive the fact that the end credits scroll strangely. (See the video I posted on Romhacking.net)
If you use pSX 1.13, it will crash at the very end of the game. You can play 98% of Policenauts, so if you absolutely love pSX, I suggest you use MemoryCardRex, convert your card over, and watch the credits and anything that may or may not be during or after them. (I do promise that this mystery content works correctly in ePSXe with either plugin.)
The pSX team has stated that the emulator is still under development and I have personally sent off Memory Dumps to the pSX staff for Policenauts Disc 2. Furthermore, one of the RHDN admins said he'd bug pSX Author for me. I won't speak on anyone's behalf but while pSX 1.13 doesn't support the very end of Policenauts right now, I think it is more than fair to assume there may be a fix coming for this. But I don't want to say anything definitive on someone else's behalf.
I consider the end credits issue an emulation one and furthermore, since there is a way to correctly emulate Policenauts, we don't think it will hold up the hack.
(that said I might look into it a little bit more if I get some spare time because I am curious about it...)
So, beta?
Well, we haven't begun final tests but we've found a couple minor bugs in replay-throughs and there's a couple graphical tweaks. There are no major issues and I think we're at a point where we're doing last minute type of stuff to make sure the game is how we want it for beta. Marc's finalizing the script, Artemio's done a lot of research for the patch.
So, almost beta. We're close and now it's kind of a matter of all of us looking at how the game currently is and any last minute additions/changes we want to make. I can say for now that major development is over and the game is functional. It's really about checking for things like typos and any bugs that snuck back in.
I wouldn't say beta just yet, but I would say "Damn it, we are getting soooo close."
If any major issues arrive, we'll keep you updated but for now, it's more tweaking and checking than further programming. Actually, I'm pretty confident that I am done writing new code for the game and I don't think I will have to look at any more assembly.
...That last part is actually pretty huge for a ROM hack, come to think of it.